Pat's 1983 URQ Alpine white #603 , 20V in progress

Document and share your build!

Pat's 1983 URQ Alpine white #603 , 20V in progress

Postby Afterthought » Thu Aug 27, 2015 9:51 pm

Ok, finally found my unicorn. I didn't think I'd be able to find one in white but I got lucky and had the cash to spend at the time.

This time around I want to have less down time as I did with my coupe and I am going to accomplish this by doing things one step at a time and not starting so many projects at once. I have goals for the suspension, brakes, engine, transmission, interior but maybe I tackle these one at a time.

So here's the story on the car.

It was purchased from the first owner in 2002 by the previous owner who had it garaged and running until he did some work to swap in an '84 fusebox and thinks maybe something pulled loose after. The interior is gutted to get to the wiring. The CIS even with fuel was not sparking is what he told me. He sourced a 3B to do the swap (needs rebuilt) and never go the 10vt running, so the car sat for years in a garage and eventually became for sale.

Excerpt from for sale ad:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Non running at the moment.
84 Fusebox under hood.
84 4K parking brakes.
late 83 diff controls.
Car has been garage kept since 2007.
spent a year outside under car cover.
Bough in 2002ish from New Jersey.
Dr. Bernardino's old car. I think he was the original owner.

Assortment of parts obviously.(no rally parts)
$10K.
Will throw in 3b engine that needs rebuild.
3b engine wiring harness.
RR airbox
Euro bumpers F+R
15x8 ronals refinished
15x8 BBS
Sloped Euro Cibies, three or four. Enough for a set.
Sloped front grill.
Mocha Leather interior
good floor carpet from a black 4K.
Clean title.
Rust on Shock towers has been welded up and POR-15
10V engine is in the car.
non cracked dashes.
X2 white vinyl rear wing uncracked.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, exciting things happening.
I was considering trying to get the CIS running so I could take my time and find all the right parts to do the 3B swap. Have alot of things to plan and figure out still. The more time I spend looking into how CIS works it makes me just want to start the swap if I value my time at all.

Using this as a scratch paper to document my goals/questions/though for where I want to car to be in the future:

PHASE 1:
-Clean up, change fluids and battery, do some quick troubleshooting on the 10v. It had air and fuel. Need to find out why it wouldn't spark.
-If the CIS looks like a dead end, then proceed with pulling the engine now and execute phase 2.

Phase 2:
-Source parts to rebuild 3B (top/bottom end gasket set, upgraded rods, t-belt, arp head studs, resurface head and block) . There was a broken cam pulley/t-belt so may have been some interference. (9/3/15 Ordered parts. Head valves for Cyl 2 and 4 did hit the pistons. Will be doing wither 3B head with new valves or AAN head. AAN looks to be in better shape. Will verify with the machine shop tomorrow.)
-3B Engine swap (Engine rebuild in progress 9/3/15)
-VEMS Econoseal with custom VEMS harness (ordered)

Phase 3:
-Upgrade suspension
-Upgrade brakes (want this thing to stop like my s4 does)

Phase 4:
-Forward Facing intake manifold (will do a custom one using TIG / T6061 Aluminum)
-Custom exhaust
-Exhaust manifold from IROZ
-Turbo from Iroz
-01E or TDI 6 speed
-Ultimate goal is 400 Wheel, should be easily obtainable and I want to build this car in such a way to leave me more headroom if I want to go up.



Couple of pics.
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Last edited by Afterthought on Sat Oct 03, 2015 6:51 pm, edited 7 times in total.
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby audifreakjim » Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:49 pm

Yess
User avatar
audifreakjim
 
Posts: 1934
Joined: Mar 3, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby Dave » Fri Aug 28, 2015 9:35 pm

I'm jealous of all the goodies that came with it!
Dave
 
Posts: 406
Joined: Feb 27, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby Afterthought » Fri Aug 28, 2015 10:08 pm

I was able to speak to Hank today and it was really helpful in figuring out my priorities.
Since my power goals aren't huge I've bumped the 6-speed trans down below the Engine/suspension/brakes, etc. on the list.

So current goals are going to be to amass the gaskets and parts I need for the 3B to get that rebuilt, and upgrade the rods while I'm in there. It's a low mileage engine so I'm not anticipating doing any bottom end work unless I see something I don't like. Based on my experience with the last AAN, rebuilding engines is a very slippery slope and if I don't leave good enough alone I will end up with 5,000 into an engine.
For starters i don't have very lofty power goals but eventually I want this car to see a bad ass turbo and manifold from IROZ. I want to upgrade the car is stages though to some extent. I have no hurry. I just want to take my time and do everything right.
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby loxxrider » Fri Aug 28, 2015 10:09 pm

That looks sweet! Best of luck. The plan sounds solid :)

Consider rods (and head studs) while you have the engine out. It isn't too expensive and is pretty much all you need for any power goals below about 500 whp.
-Chris

'91 Audi 200 20v - Revver/BAT project
'91 Audi 200 20v Avant
'01 Anthracite M5
'90 M3
'85 Euro 635csi
'12 X3
E34 530i (maybe rear-mount soon)
User avatar
loxxrider
 
Posts: 6637
Joined: Feb 27, 2013
Location: Jupiter, FL / Somewhere, PA

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby Afterthought » Fri Aug 28, 2015 10:15 pm

loxxrider wrote:That looks sweet! Best of luck. The plan sounds solid :)

Consider rods (and head studs) while you have the engine out. It isn't too expensive and is pretty much all you need for any power goals below about 500 whp.


Chris i'm at least going to do rods and ARP head studs, (MLS head gasket?)
Is there a need for main studs? I assume I can leave that stuff alone.
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby loxxrider » Fri Aug 28, 2015 11:32 pm

Yes, also do MLS gasket. No need for main studs. That should be about it though.
-Chris

'91 Audi 200 20v - Revver/BAT project
'91 Audi 200 20v Avant
'01 Anthracite M5
'90 M3
'85 Euro 635csi
'12 X3
E34 530i (maybe rear-mount soon)
User avatar
loxxrider
 
Posts: 6637
Joined: Feb 27, 2013
Location: Jupiter, FL / Somewhere, PA

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby Afterthought » Sat Aug 29, 2015 2:20 am

Anyone on here done the Fusebox conversion from 1983 to newer 1984 style?
I am looking for some wiring diagrams of both, so I can see exactly what has been done. Only having luck finding diagrams from the UK
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby PRY4SNO » Sat Aug 29, 2015 2:07 pm

Nice score!

I'm not 100% sure, but I think ads (Adam) has done something like that on his Urq.
Find me on Instagram @pry4sno

1992 80 quattro 20v /// Eventual AAN'd Winter Sled

1990 Coupe quattro /// Because Racecar

Spare parts for sale
User avatar
PRY4SNO
 
Posts: 1878
Joined: Mar 3, 2013
Location: Edmonton, AB

Re: 1983 URQ project.

Postby Afterthought » Tue Sep 01, 2015 9:32 pm

Some pics of the general condition of the car. I don't think it's been washed in 7 years, should clean up real nice when i get around to it. This is exactly as it was delivered.

Exterior:
Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Pulled off a Fender to see what the preventative POR-15 rust repair looked like:
Image

Image

Couple quick shots of the interior:
Front of carpet is out, lower dash and glovebox is out to access wiring. Cluster, etc. out

Image

Image

Image

Image

Current state of the engine bay:

Image

Image

Underside:

Image

Image

One problem area to note:
Image

Spares:
Image

Image

SQ manifold. Has a crack.
Image
Image


RR airbox
Image

3B and harness:
Image
Image

The 3B engine sustained some contact to the front, enough to break the cam sprocket. So I will need to source one of those, strip the engine, pull the head off and see if there was contact. Other than that it's a low mileage engine and will make a great heart for the car.
At a minimum I will do ARP head studs and upgraded rods and resurface block and head to seal the MLS head gasket. Other than that I dont have any plans to go crazy.
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby carl » Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:08 am

Nice ride, not too far gone either, looks like just a lil bit of metal replacement/rust work todo. Wish i had redone the wiring in my 83 when i had a donor coupe gt, thought i should be keeping it original :hammer: .

I know the singled out fuel pump relay wire going to the fuse box can be easily forgotten if that helps any. Imo you should get some supertech inconel exhaust valves while you're at it (vw 16v), the stock sodiums can snap off and are pretty flow restrictive. If you're changing the rods, you should get some coated bearings too. There's also a lightweight flywheel, the clutch 707 pressure plate and adding extra meat on the flywheel tdc pin for vems to think of.
carl
 
Posts: 126
Joined: Mar 7, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby alxdgr8 » Wed Sep 02, 2015 12:13 pm

Lots of potential and lots of cool rare parts! Going to be awesome when it's done Pat!
Too bad you couldn't have gone down to Texas to pick it up yourself, I imagine Bufkin would be one hell of a guy to meet and talk Audi's with.
-Alex- @vexartmedia on Instagram
1992 Porsche 968 (07K transplant in progress)
1983 Aud UrQ (20vt swap in progress)
1995 Audi 90QS (Previously 32v V8, now AEB 1.8T)
1986 Audi Coupe GT (7A swap and more)
2010 VW Touareg TDI (DD, tow rig)
2001 Ducati ST4
User avatar
alxdgr8
 
Posts: 868
Joined: Feb 28, 2013
Location: Federal Way, WA

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Audiurq » Wed Sep 02, 2015 2:20 pm

Sounds like you have the basis of a great ur-q. Look forward to following the
progress.

I am in the process of swapping a Coupe GT 85+ wiring loom in to my '83 ur-q.
Biggest issue is getting an un-cut Coupe GT loom and then you have to remove
most of the interior to install it, and cut/enlarge holes in the firewall and
hole for the fuse box.

I don't think you will be able to use that sport manifold with the RR air box.
Quite a bit of work to the inner fender to make the RR air box work.

cheers, Mike
Audiurq
 
Posts: 43
Joined: Mar 2, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Afterthought » Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:22 pm

carl wrote:Nice ride, not too far gone either, looks like just a lil bit of metal replacement/rust work todo. Wish i had redone the wiring in my 83 when i had a donor coupe gt, thought i should be keeping it original :hammer: .

I know the singled out fuel pump relay wire going to the fuse box can be easily forgotten if that helps any. Imo you should get some supertech inconel exhaust valves while you're at it (vw 16v), the stock sodiums can snap off and are pretty flow restrictive. If you're changing the rods, you should get some coated bearings too. There's also a lightweight flywheel, the clutch 707 pressure plate and adding extra meat on the flywheel tdc pin for vems to think of.


As far as the fuse box I only see a couple things that arent connected. I checked all the fuses today and only found one bad one. When james last tried to crank it over he mentioned it didn't have spark. So I'll start doing some looking tomorrow at things. Try to find where the power to the IGN coil comes from.
Image

As of right now my plan is: H Beam Rods, and I'd like to do the bearings but I think I have to get the block apart and get the new rods and plastigage the clearance with the new rods before I order the coated bearings don't I? Or I could take it to a local machine shop and have them handle all that.
For an ECU I'll run a VEMS Econoseal with a custom VEMS harness.
I Haven't put any thought towards the clutch yet but will probably be looking at something like a SPEC 3+ (good for 450+ WHP) ?

Audiurq wrote:Sounds like you have the basis of a great ur-q. Look forward to following the
progress.

I am in the process of swapping a Coupe GT 85+ wiring loom in to my '83 ur-q.
Biggest issue is getting an un-cut Coupe GT loom and then you have to remove
most of the interior to install it, and cut/enlarge holes in the firewall and
hole for the fuse box.

I don't think you will be able to use that sport manifold with the RR air box.
Quite a bit of work to the inner fender to make the RR air box work.

cheers, Mike


The sport manifold is just cool to have but I don't think I'll use it.
I have a stock EM for now, with a K26. Id like to get the engine in the car and running, then down the road I will do custom manifold, exhaust, and a real cool turbo.
I have to look at the airbox and what it requires and find some pictures. Im hesitant to cut anything on this car.
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Afterthought » Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:24 pm

alxdgr8 wrote:Lots of potential and lots of cool rare parts! Going to be awesome when it's done Pat!
Too bad you couldn't have gone down to Texas to pick it up yourself, I imagine Bufkin would be one hell of a guy to meet and talk Audi's with.

Alex it would have been so bad ass to go get it, mainly just to see all the super cool and rare stuff James has. I haven't had a day off work since I got the car, got off at 5 am and today was my first chance to even look at it.
Let the games begin.
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Afterthought » Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:33 pm

Took some time today to work on the car, no power to the windows so I used a wire and battery to roll up the drivers side window so I could push it outside to pressure wash the car...
There looks to be paint yellowish paint overspray over the whole car and windows. Everything except the front fenders since they were off. Not sure how I'm going to get that off.
Started washing until a lightning storm went directly over my house.
Image
Image
So I pushed it back in the shop and started to disassemble the engine. Of course the power went out
Good news is I don't see any contact from the valves on the pistons. Should be real obvious, right??
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image

Looks like this plastic cover and the cam gear were the only casualties of the contact on the front pf the engine.
Image
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Dave » Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:44 pm

cyl 2 and 4 look like they might have had impact. see the intake valves how they have the line? thats what they look like when they hit the valve reliefs on the pistons.
Dave
 
Posts: 406
Joined: Feb 27, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Dave » Wed Sep 02, 2015 9:47 pm

like this; Image
Dave
 
Posts: 406
Joined: Feb 27, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Afterthought » Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:15 pm

They do have that little line. So what's the protocol then , leak down test?
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Dave » Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:16 pm

ehh it doesnt cost much to replace them and feel confident about the motor.
Dave
 
Posts: 406
Joined: Feb 27, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby ringbearer » Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:57 pm

Clay bar that overspray, but it's prob very old and hard.
Looks like a great project for sure.
User avatar
ringbearer
 
Posts: 1134
Joined: Feb 27, 2013
Location: Nor-Cal

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Afterthought » Thu Sep 03, 2015 8:40 am

Dave wrote:ehh it doesnt cost much to replace them and feel confident about the motor.

Ok. Good call.
Lightweight? Oversize or stock? what do you guys think. Ferrea?
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby jretal » Thu Sep 03, 2015 9:18 am

Is it me, or is there a crack in the head at the top left in this picture:

Image

?

Regardless, glad to see you managed to make the deal go through. I'd say get it running and do a road trip to visit James and catch up on the Audi BS'ing you could have done if time had permitted you to get it in person :)

Good luck with the build! And NICE shop! I'm a little jealous :)
jretal
 
Posts: 448
Joined: Mar 4, 2013

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby Afterthought » Thu Sep 03, 2015 9:33 am

It looks like a crack but it's actually a piece of gasket. I do see a couple small crack near the spark plug holes on #2 and #4 cyl. Pictured below:
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x41 ... vtoamo.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x41 ... bdolu1.jpg

This is my "spare" AAN head that Issam at INA worked really hard to get me (no joke, thanks Issam!!!)

http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x41 ... lyiy1a.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x41 ... zprhvw.jpg
http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x41 ... pzm0lp.jpg

So if I remove some of the carbon and don't see any cracks by the spark plug holes, I will take the AAN head in and have a leak down done on it.
I found in the QW urs4/s6 FAQ that Audi says "Cylinder heads with cracks between the valve seats or between the valve seat and spark plug threads may be reused without reducing service life, provided cracks do not exceed 0.5 mm (0.020 in) width or when no more than the first threads are cracked".
****
Afterthought

1983 UrQuattro - http://theprojectpad.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1819&p=72513#p72513
1983 Ur Quattro
GMC 2500HD
Afterthought
 
Posts: 583
Joined: Jan 16, 2014
Location: Bellingham, Wa

Re: 1983 URQ: project unicorn : Pic heavy

Postby PRY4SNO » Thu Sep 03, 2015 11:38 am

Upgrading the exhaust valves is almost a no brainer. My head was basically new (10,000 km) but Hank convinced me that $160 on some Ferrea valves was cheap insurance, considering the alternative costs associated with dropping a valve. During that discussion I asked him about the valve sizing and his take was that for the power range I'm shooting for it's best to keep the velocity high and stay stock size. I think you go up when you cross the gt30/gt35 threshold.
Find me on Instagram @pry4sno

1992 80 quattro 20v /// Eventual AAN'd Winter Sled

1990 Coupe quattro /// Because Racecar

Spare parts for sale
User avatar
PRY4SNO
 
Posts: 1878
Joined: Mar 3, 2013
Location: Edmonton, AB

Next

Return to Projects

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 6 guests

cron